Religions: Runes and the Sun

Religion: Runes and the Sun

Here is a compilation of a few Rune-related quotes that I've found. I thought I had a firm grasp on the subject, but after reading a few of the quotes that I had previously not known about, I'm beginning to think that my knowledge about Runes isn't complete. Although, no one's knowledge on the Runes is probably complete (save some people, like Meridian and perhaps Beta testers), for we don't know so much about the game. Now, here are those quotes.
In reply to: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Early in the second century of the Age of Days the Elves of the Deathless Empire first discovered the scattered Runestones, the lost fragments of the Giant-Carved saga that foretold the destiny of the World. After much experiment, the Elvish masters learned to tap into their power. Some Magi, not content with harnessing the Stones' power, tried to fashion new Runestones of their own. Their efforts all failed, and most ended in disaster. Finally, the High Concordat of Magi ended their experiments, and further study or research in the topic was forbidden. So it would remain for centuries, until the rise of Men. Almeus the Young, tutor of Zaristan and one of the greatest Wizards Humankind has ever known, discovered the principles of Sorcery after he seized the throne of Paolus, First King of Brethild. From arcane grimoires of the Deathless Empire the Wizard learned of the Elvish efforts to create Runestones, and took up the cause himself. Even Almeus could not succeed in fashioning new Runestones (for truly, they are the work of the All-Father, and beyond the power of lesser beings), but his attempts prompted other discoveries which revolutionized Magic throughout the World."
-Sorcery discipline ___ ______ ___ "Six times six were the runes the All-Father first carved at the dawn of the world, and they are used by the Northmen in their writing to this day.
Five of these are Runes of Power, whose making will bring potent magic and power to the maker. The redes that empower the other one-and-thirty runes are the prized secret of the greatest Rune Casters, and some have been forgotten."
-Rune Caster discipline ___ ______ ___ Thurin took his leave of Malog and returned to Haganduur. At his forge he took the lock of the Goddess’ Hair and spun it into wire, bright and fair yet harder than steel. Thurin melted the wire in his forge and fashioned a hilt for his masterwork, cruelly barbed yet fair to behold. And as he worked Thurin sang mighty spells that coiled around the hilt, spells of Light, of Law, and of Power. When the work was done Thurin joined the hilt to the blade, and the gold shone forth with the mingled light of the dead Moon and the newborn Sun. Seven Runes of Power were graven on the blade, each the life’s work of one of the seven Forge Masters. Thurin honed its edge on the Bones of the World. The darkness of the blade was balanced by the radiance of the hilt, and the Chaos stuff of Callanthyr was bound forever into a new form, ordered by the Shaper’s will and vision.
-The Legend, the Age of Twilight ___ ______ ___ "And then the All-Father laughed, for the knowledge of the joten was incomplete. They had learned the Making, but had no inkling of the Unmaking. When the joten sundered the Cliffs of Fate, they released the power that the All-Father's redes had sealed inside them. Once freed, the power of the saga moved over the face of the world, and reshaped it. The sun rose for the first time, and the turn of seasons began.
Thus, through their spite, the joten fulfilled the All-Father's design and set the wyrd of the world in motion." "... And the elder giant was angered, and bellowed so loudly that the snow slid off the roof of the hall. "Dwarves!" he cried, "sooty, stunted little thieves! They know nothing of the All-Father's greatest gift! I know the names and redes of all the runes, six times six!" "... The giant's rage knew no bounds. He roared a third and final time, and his voice sent avalanches of snow sweeping into the valleys. "Clumsy? I am Ymur the Old, Lord of the Joten! I carved the Runes of Power on the Cliffs of Fate an age before your fathers were ever conceived!" And the giant took up his drinking horn, and carved all of the All-Father's runes upon it with his table knife. And as he carved, the giant named the runes and sang the redes under his breath. And when he was done, he flung his knife to the table and hurled the horn to Cuthric, who caught it in both hands. "How clumsy are these hands now, whelp? Is this not fine work?"" "... And with a cat's speed Cuthric took the giant's knife from the table and smashed the drinking horn. And so the magic of all the runes, six times six, was released - and yet, since the same tool was used for the Making and Unmaking, the magic was ill formed, and swept the Hall like a storm. Thunder and fire smote the walls and tumbled down the high roof." "... The giant then sang a song of madness which echoed across the mountains, driving bird and beast into frenzy.
Cuthric heard the song but heeded it not: he had carved the Man rune onto a pine branch and unmade it, and the rune was proof against Ymur's song."
-The Grimskolderissaga -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ok, from my point of view, these stories are a little conflicting. Now I'm going to put together some of the things that I noticed.
In reply to: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Five of these are Runes of Power, whose making will bring potent magic and power to the maker. The redes that empower the other one-and-thirty runes are the prized secret of the greatest Rune Casters, and some have been forgotten."
-Rune Caster discipline Here's what I find conflicting: "Seven Runes of Power were graven on the blade..." -The Legend, the Age of Twilight "...redes of all the runes, six times six!"
-The Weltwyrdangssaga "I am Ymur the Old, Lord of the Joten! I carved the Runes of Power on the Cliffs of Fate..." -The Weltwyrdangssaga "... the magic of all the runes, six times six, was released..."
-The Weltwyrdangssaga "... carved the Man rune onto a pine branch and unmade it..."
-The Weltwyrdangssaga -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- First of all, the first quote says that there are five Runes of Power. The first conflicting quote states that seven Runes of Power were carved, which I don't understand, since the first quote says there are only five Runes of Power. Second, the statement, "... Runes of Power, whose making will bring potent magic and power to the maker.", led me to believe that these Runes didn't need to be Unmade for their power to begin to work, and didn't need redes ("The redes that empower the other one-and-thirty runes"). But then the second and third conflicting quotes state that all thirty six Runes require redes. And the last conflicting quote takes one of the five given Runes of Power (from the Rune Caster page), and has it unmade by Cuthric. One more thing I find interesting - the third conflicting quote has Ymur talking about carving the Runes of Power on the Cliffs of Fate... is he using those words as a general term for all Runes? Or perhaps he had the duty of carving out just the Runes of Power? Any ideas? Another thing I found interesting... Thurin carved seven Runes of Power on the Shadowbane, in the Age of Twilight. However, the All-Father sought the knowledge of the Serpent Beast Lord after the Taming, in which Shadowbane was used. So obviously, Thurin knew of Runes before the All-Father, or there were some type of Rune before the Weltwyrdangssaga, Runes that were similarly called Runes of Power.
In reply to: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "After much experiment, the Elvish masters learned to tap into their power."
-Sorcerer discipline -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ok, I had figured that after a Rune was Unmade, it was just a piece of rock with a carving in it.
I had figured that the power that came from the rede had already done what it was supposed to do. But according to this, the pieces of stone from the Weltwyrdangssaga still hold powers within them... thoughts? Perhaps all the Runes can be referred to as Runes of Power, and perhaps all the Runes, even the five mentioned Runes of Power, have to be Unmade and a rede must be sang. But from all the different quotes, I was beginning to get a little confused, and now I want to the community of Shadowbane to tell everyone what you think of this. By- Anteni With some careful analysis, a lot of the contradictions that are bedeviling you can fall away. You have to remember that all of these fragments are primary historical sources - each infused with their own myths and legends. You also have to remember that there's up to 5,000 years of history between the events discussed and the "present." How much can get lost? How much can get garbled? That's a good excuse for a pretty high factor of ambiguity. Now, to try and explain the ambiguities, read between the lines and think like a historian or an archaeologist. The way I figure it, there are two basic Runic traditions (it's an implied given): the Thurin runes the ones the Shaper devised and taught the Dwarves, and the others ones. I'll name these the Fate Runes, the ones the All-Father discovered and used in the saga. How can we reconcile these two traditions? Well, it seems plausible to me that Thurin caught on to Rune power through his own skill and wisdom, and managed to deduce, in a rough way, how names, naming, and runes work. His picture was NOT complete. Neither, coincidentally enough, was Ymur's - could one giant's mind really hold all the secrets of fate itself? If the Shaper had known everything the All-Father had known, then he'd have probably carved the Cliffs of Fate. The six times six runes the Giant took so much pride in knowing were simply all the Runes he could remember (and hey, they're more than enough for an alphabet, so who needs more?). The modern Runecasting tradition (the Disacipline description) mentions five runes of power - I don't seem to recall it EVER saying that these are the only five. They're just the five most often carved today. How many have been lost in 4,000 years? Perhaps the Invorri Maker-Unmakers started with thirty six, and don't have many left. Or, the real masters hoard the true secrets of the Art. That's not exactly unheard of in mystic traditions, you know... I mean, you even solve your own dilemma when you quote the rest of the sentence. Read that quote more carefully. So, technically, there's no conflict in the Runecaster description, the tale of Cutrhic, or the Legend of Shadowbane. Heck, they're arguably not even the same Runic alphabets. (Also, I wish to point out that in NO place does the legend of Shadowbane imply that the seven runes carved on the blade are the ONLY seven runes - they were just the only ones carved on the blade). This brings us to the overlap between Shadowbane's runes and the Runecaster runes (Eolh, I believe). If Shadowbane is using Thurin's runes (devised by the Shaper himself) and the Runecasters are using the Fate Runes (learned from the Giants who learned them from the All-Father who learned them in a vision), how can the same character show up in both places? Well, it could be that Thurin was a pretty clever guy and deduced even in his incomplete picture that the forces locked within Eolh were one of the keys to power. He's really sharp. In RL, two cultures that I can think of both clued in to the concept of the numeral zero without any contact. Also, we don't really have any idea how Thurin learned his runes: we just know that he knew them. Maybe the All-Father wasn't the first to pay Serpent a visit. Heck, one has to wonder how the All-Father even knew to go to Serpent in the first place... But, before we go spinning conspiracy theories and adding unknown chapters to Thurin's life, we must acknowledge another possibility. It's entirely possible that Invorri Runecasters are carving Thurin's runes without really knowing where they got them. The average person today has no idea the debts that Western science and philosophy owe to the Arab world, we just use our science and philosophy to make our lives better. As you'll recall, when shown Runes, Cuthric himself thought instantly that they must have come from Dwarves. If Thurin's runes and the Fate Runes seemed to work the same way, it's more than likely that the Invorri could have absorbed runes from each tradition and not necessarily be aware of which pieces come from where. Don't be afraid of contradicitons: they are meant to be there in the lore. I tried to be a scholar when I wrote this stuff. Try to read it like a scholar, and you can find some startling hints buried away. Actually, if you read it carefully, it says the Sun ROSE for the first time - it moved. The Sun had been there for a timeless while, but up in the frozen North it just wasn't very visible in the sky (that's one reason the Dar Khelegur made their homes there). That changed when time began. No, there was only one - the Dragon set it on fire, it sat there a long while, barely visible in the Northern sky, and THEN it moved. The beginning of Time happened after the Dragon's rise.